π¬ Is it possible to freeze your fuel lines on airplanes?!?!?
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@douglasvb I think they all just turned into instant icicle in that movie π
@ai6yr Iβm not sure having more information about close calls and these limits (and the jet crash in Florida) help me enjoy my travel.
Iβm not afraid of flying, and Iβm *required* to do it, but thereβs a fine line between βstatistically itβs really safeβ and reading about the many times itβs almost not.
@bolderbekah LOL well, you could mute my mentions of aviation or ACARS, I do try to tag them. You should be afraid of coffee makers and lavatories by now π
@ai6yr lol.
I mean, Iβve also watched Lost and its crash scenes on transatlantic flightsβ¦. I think I skipped watching Final Destination though?
@ai6yr if I'm not mistaken jet fuel is more or less kerosene. And at right around -40 some of the distillates in it start to turn solid. Not all of them, bit enough that it can become a problem.
I don't the original source for this, but this says 737-6/900 can go down to -43C before fuel freezes... so they are not far from there for sure. π€― Brrrrrr
https://www.scribd.com/document/834566484/Boeing-737-Limitations
@ai6yr
What I really want to know is there is why the 737-1/500 can tolerate -45C, but the 6/900 can only go to -43C
@PaulWermer @ai6yr The 737 Next Gen models had heat exchangers to take heat from the hydraulic systems and dump it into the fuel. The Jurassic 737s used pumps and engine heat, which could get more energy into the fuel but was inefficient and not as reliable.
Small decrease in capability in the interest of efficiency, which is not surprising in an airliner.
737s have come in four families...the original 100 & 200 series, now called the Jurassic series by plane buffs, the 200 through 500 series are called Classics, the Next Generation is the 600, 700, 800, 900 and 900ER, and the latest group are the Max planes.
@W6KME @ai6yr @PaulWermer If the Max planes can reach higher altitudes, does this mean they have Max Headroom?
I'll be here all week.
GFS says air at 40,000ft (they are at 39,000ft, flight level 390) is -65C.
To get down to warmer than 37C, they have to descend to somewhere slightly above 23,000ft, it appears.
So that must mean airplanes in polar vortexes/Canada/etc. must have to fly much lower in winter? (interesting)
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If ACARS Drama Jumpseat is correct, they immediately descended to 33,000 ft, which apparently was warm enough for the fuel, and then did a gradual descent to their destination and arrived safely. π€·
Interesting, so looking at all the planes above 39,000 ft over there... not a lot. Did these other folks load up with JET-B (-50C) so don't care, or are they relying on it taking awhile to get cold? Or maybe they haven't noticed it yet? π€· Very interesting, anyway. #aviation
@ai6yr huzzah!
Thermodynamics wins again!
@ai6yr BA38 accident at Heathrow a few years ago comes to mind, it was caused by ice in the fuel oil heat exchanger https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_38
@ai6yr they would likely use Jet B, or an additive package to ensure the fuel flows at the expected temperature
Socializing with a B-52 fuels guy in North Dakota for 8 years has its trivia hazards
@ai6yr The fuel can gel, but itβs more likely condensed water freezing in the lines. They usually add a fuel additive called βPristβ which is like βHeetβ for gasoline engines.
Water condensing in fuel tanks has been a very common issue in planes forever. Thereβs frequently a low point(s) in the system where water is regularly drained off.
https://www.univarsolutions.com/suppliers/pristaerospace/prist-anti-icing-fuel-additive
@LabSpokane @ai6yr I remember sampling fuel from a Cessna 172 tank and holding it up to look for water before takeoff. Of course, that particular plane also was carburated and had a βcarb iceβ lever to open and close the engine cowling a bit to thaw out the carburetor.
from the time i froze my radiator solid going 80 on the expressway, even with only "radiator fluid" in it.
guessing that there is probably still enough water in the fuel to freeze and clog the fuel line if it's cold enough...
@paul_ipv6 you did what now? How cold was it outside, yet dry enough roads to not worry about hitting ice?
so...
temp was -20F/-28C, windchill was -45F/-42C. i was driving directly into the wind at 75mph/120kph, so wind chill was much higher... at that temp, even the small amount of water from the radiator fluid being exposed to air was enough for some of it to freeze.
the plus (i guess) is that at that temp, it was too cold to snow?
@paul_ipv6 @ai6yr what happened after it froze? This doesnβt seem like conditions Iβd want to be out in. I keep blankets in the car in winter but not for that temp.
@ai6yr it gets cold up there, insanely cold!
@ai6yr wasn't that what happened to a helicopter in The Day After Tomorrow?