the hades art is good but it's not sexy but they act like it is, it feels devoid of emotion tbh
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48 min. ago
@sun there's definitely something weird about how deathly afraid the diversity artstyle is of being attractive to men who like women
@moth_ball one theory is it’s just a filter for their audience which is okay but don’t bullshit me
@sun @moth_ball think same reason the anime girl is off putting and weird to me is why the hades stuff is to you?
@vriska @sun @moth_ball The anime girl is definitely not a deliberate filter (the guys drawing it do it with all honesty as an attempt to draw the cutest thing they can, and they talk about this when interviewed by/with people they wouldn't lie to/in front of) but it does have the effect accidentally. The hades stuff is very likely deliberate.
Both being forms of gatekeeping would be great if everyone was honest about it.
Both being forms of gatekeeping would be great if everyone was honest about it.
@nerthos @vriska @moth_ball One asshole at Sony blocked all the anime girl games for years. Nobody blocked Hades. The people that though it was great Sony blocked anime games like Hades. So I don't break bread with them even though I think it's a good game.
@nerthos @moth_ball @vriska I even said I like the Hades art but they had to make a few characters sexy and it's not the vibe. The artist is good the director is bad.
@sun @moth_ball @nerthos I would like the op more if the anime girl example wasn't so repulsive to me
@vriska @sun @moth_ball It can't all be megumin sadly
I do think you underguess age tho, the example anime girl is definitely drawn as "young adult, smug, dolled up" down to the face and body proportions of an early 20s heavy makeup jap woman like you'd see from an idol or hostess at an expensive club.
It's just very clearly made by a straight man to appeal to straight men, and will get the same reaction from you that a woman drawn by a lesbian to appeal to lesbians will get from a straight man. Concept of "lesbian pretty" and all that I remember we discussed at some point, strong bifurcation in the idea of what characteristics portray attractiveness and sexual desirability.
Stylized sharp teeth and tongue are felinesque/vampireish because "graceful but dangerous like a cat" is an extremely appealing aesthetic for men, and the basic structure of anime girl face is "grab human head and make it slightly more cat-like, sharper, bigger eyes".
I do think you underguess age tho, the example anime girl is definitely drawn as "young adult, smug, dolled up" down to the face and body proportions of an early 20s heavy makeup jap woman like you'd see from an idol or hostess at an expensive club.
It's just very clearly made by a straight man to appeal to straight men, and will get the same reaction from you that a woman drawn by a lesbian to appeal to lesbians will get from a straight man. Concept of "lesbian pretty" and all that I remember we discussed at some point, strong bifurcation in the idea of what characteristics portray attractiveness and sexual desirability.
Stylized sharp teeth and tongue are felinesque/vampireish because "graceful but dangerous like a cat" is an extremely appealing aesthetic for men, and the basic structure of anime girl face is "grab human head and make it slightly more cat-like, sharper, bigger eyes".
@nerthos @moth_ball @sun you know the reason they draw them like that is because of Donald ducks influence on early anime right?
@vriska @moth_ball @sun Yes. Betty boop, donald duck, and so on, all operate on the same basic idea of "add cute animal characteristics to character to make it cuter"
@nerthos @moth_ball @sun bro thinks Donald duck is cute (hehe
when I learn more about make up and so on, I started to realize that my first impression will always be totally wrong. so I need to take a second look, third look, or fifth look to finally understand what happening in the still image.
but I agree that maybe the hades art isn't "sexy". I think the artist intent didn't fully went to "sexy". something that resembles sadness, loneliness, but keeping the strong look(?) despite with a little sexiness showing the bare skin and a bit cleavage.
meanwhile japanese artist esp the kind being displayed on the left, always direct with emotion and message. that is the power of artist that lives in social media, know where the hook at and know how to make strong of it when people scroll through things (?)
@ganbold I didn't post the whole discourse, there are characters where the whole point is eros and they are basically in the same style, the artist is quite good at what they do but not at eros. in general though a complaint is a lot of the art is subtly "off" which tbh you can complain about a lot of western comic style illustration like that where someone gets amazing draftsman skills but can't draw an emotive face very well
@sun in the defense of hades it is art that is both a small part of the screen, meant to be readable, and not distract from the text all too much, and easily changeable on the head enough to account for different facial expressions and head angles.
@themilkman @sun Fire Emblem did that too, but the right way.
@nerthos @sun the anime artstyle gets way too much leeway because it's associated with the content that they are usually a part of not because the artstyle itself is good, don't get me wrong the artstyle is good and i am a fan of it, but the reason most do this argument is not because it is superior, but because they associate it with the medium.
it's kind of like how a lot of Video game soundtracks work, the game gives the tension and context to the song, so both end up elevating each other, but video game soundtracks are not above and beyond usual music, it's because the context of the game elevates the emotional context of the song, without that emotional context (or the knowledge of the context) the songs aren't all that great, not calling VGOSTs bad either, they serve their roles as video game soundtracks well, but they are designed for the game and rely on the game and surrounding context for their emotional resonance and tension.
it's kind of like how a lot of Video game soundtracks work, the game gives the tension and context to the song, so both end up elevating each other, but video game soundtracks are not above and beyond usual music, it's because the context of the game elevates the emotional context of the song, without that emotional context (or the knowledge of the context) the songs aren't all that great, not calling VGOSTs bad either, they serve their roles as video game soundtracks well, but they are designed for the game and rely on the game and surrounding context for their emotional resonance and tension.
@themilkman @nerthos I've been a major comic fan since childhood and there are pros and cons to both western and japanese comics, but the illustration and the stories, but at this point manga completely eclipses western comics. there are many great western comics however that would never happen in japan.
@themilkman @sun I pointed at Fire Emblem specifically because it is good, not because it's anime-ish. Plenty of oriental aesthetic games that do it really wrong.
@sun it's also mega "safe horny" and even quite ugly in places, that one face shot in the upper left is just... there's just something super wrong about it
All these women characters and there's a sheer lack of femininity
All these women characters and there's a sheer lack of femininity
@coolboymew @sun
In fairness, the one in the top left of the grid appears to be a CG for a specific bath scene, her regular portrait isn't too weird. The one in the bottom left is also cute.
The ones on the right are definitely lesbian-esque though, especially the bottom right.
@yomiel @coolboymew they look good but sterile
@sun @coolboymew
I get what you mean, sorta. The style itself doesn't really evoke much emotion in me, but I can appreciate that it's well made.
@coolboymew the artist is clearly skilled but this is just not their forte, they were a good artist that was incorrectly picked.
@sun I'd have to see the rest of their art to judge, but bottom left is a seriously good design that still ultimately leaves me feeling nothing whatsoever
To be this bad at being good takes skills
To be this bad at being good takes skills
@coolboymew imagine being an artist and you have to dodge ideological minefields instead of expressing yourself
ALSO, you can find WAY SEXIER than even that pic from random artists on Japanese twitter. There is a reason that manga has almost completely erased the american comic industry, they are objectively better at it except for a few western standouts
@sun
you're not the target audience (women in their 30s
you're not the target audience (women in their 30s
@ageha comic audience has changed and that’s finr
@sun
suppose applies more broadly, but meant the game hades specifically. seems to be a hit with 30-something tumblr women and theys, same people reading all those "greek myth reimagined" books past few years and also apparently bad musical adaptations? had one of these as a neighbour, moved out last year
suppose applies more broadly, but meant the game hades specifically. seems to be a hit with 30-something tumblr women and theys, same people reading all those "greek myth reimagined" books past few years and also apparently bad musical adaptations? had one of these as a neighbour, moved out last year
25 years ago this would be rejected for looking too much like concept art, it has a real concept art vibe to it you used to see for moviemaking materials. I can't explain it well, I'm sorry.
