Discussion
Did I just write almost 5000 words about why generative "AI" should be resisted, going through every single one of my reasons?
Yes. Because I need this article to exist so I can point people to it.
Enjoy and share widely.
https://estherweidauer.com/articles/why-resist-generative-ai.html
@aesthr Thank you for writing this. Most of the same points have been kicking around in my head around this, and it was cathartic to read.
@aesthr Good for you.
Me too. Every day I write something. Not to publish, but to order my thoughts away from chaos. I’m at currently at, if you support any AI you’re a climate change denialist.
Sorry if this seems like a thread hijacking.
@aesthr Esther, this is such a good article.
Thank you for this.
@aesthr Thank you for this! Very helpful :)
Maybe i misunderstand something here:
"A more implicit example could be the steam engine. It’s not just an invention that happened in a vacuum. Without the political and economical framework of the fossil fuel industry it can’t operate and would lose its entire reason for existing."
'steam engine' needs fossil fuel industry?
Should it say ´combustion engine' or smthg?
@cagraphics Steam engines require coal (a fossil fuel)
Although you can load the firebox with wood, it doesn't burn hot and long enough, meaning you can't carry enough fuel on the train for your journey without sacrificing a prohibitive amount of passenger/cargo capacity
@ben @cagraphics exactly.
Technically you can run a steam engine on wood (which still means it'll require a foresting industry) but to make it efficient in an industrial application, fossil fuels are required.
And modern natural gas power plants are also steam generators. Running those on wood would be extremely difficult.
The idea of wood-fired power plants reminds me of this: there was talk of using chicken droppings to help fuel a power plant, though we've recently decided not to - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce85dq9qvvlo
Well worth a boost, thank you so much for writing it 🙏
@aesthr I've been having the intention of writing this article for a long time, actually have a preliminary version.
Yours is so much better written, more comprehensive and better sourced than mine would. Thank you so much.
Would you be OK if I translated it to Spanish and posted in on my blog at some point? Referencing you of course.
@delcano That would be awesome, yes! :)
@aesthr This is my first iteration, still subject to review by other people: https://blep.org/por-que-resisto-a-la-%C2%ABia%C2%BB-generativa/
Por qué resisto ante la «IA» generativa
@delcano btw, if you want to use the same cover image, feel free to copy it over there too
@aesthr This is very, very good. Thank you.
@aesthr this is an excellent summary of the issues and much more eloquently stated than I could put it. I'll share with colleagues
@aesthr Thank you for writing this and sharing it. It´s bookmarked and will be put to good use.
I just wish I could have it printed on a t-shirt I could point to, when some guy (it´s always a guy somehow) starts rambling about AI.
@aesthr good post covering a lot of ground, thanks. I liked the calm tone and the references.
Maybe I missed it on a first reading but I didn't see any discussion of the copyright theft issues and the effects on writers / artists / musicians.
There are some parts where I would have been more strident if I was writing it, but that probably just shows my biases - as I mentioned earlier, a good calm tone.
Thanks
@imcdowall yeah I might add a section about the stolen training data but I have to think about it some more in order to not just accidentally write something pro-copyright
@aesthr @imcdowall Moral rights might be the angle you're looking for: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_rights
Feels like it should be possible to argue for the basic theory of a creator's moral rights over their work, without propping up any particular implementation of copyright law.
(As an author in the U.S., I rely upon U.S. copyright law for my livelihood, but at the same time decry the deep flaws in its implementation and the inequity in its selective enforcement.)
@aesthr thank you for writing this!!!
I’m not quite through reading yet, so maybe you’ll pick the topic up again later, and filling it in:
I was surprised to not see a sentence to the effect of “And we can (and do) change them.” at the end of:
> What we do know is that the human mind is not a set of computer instructions. Neither is it a disembodied entity that’s just piloting a body. We are embodied beings and our bodies are an integral part of who we are.
@danyow that's not in there because it's not really relevant here. The point is that we ARE our bodies and not just HAVE one.
@aesthr Really good and well-sourced piece, thank you for writing and sharing it!!
I spotted two typos, in case it's useful:
"generative pe-trained tranformer" -> pre-trained?
"Longermism" -> longtermism?
Now the question is how do we go through people who have already caught the genAI virus? I've been sharing these arguments with some that I know and it's just not going through...
@elduvelle in my experience you need to find a thing they care about and then tell them about how "AI" damages that thing.
For example I've had success with a data-protection angle recently for people in the medical sector who do really care about the confidentiality of their clients
@aesthr
Thanks for taking the time to write this!
@elduvelle
I also take the approach of focusing on a thing they care about. The feeling "it's just not going through" is shared! Some reply "I know you are right, but I'll continue to use it nevertheless". But it is necessary and useful to explain once and again; like planting a seed, the effect is not immediately visible, and often it simply won't germinate. But sometimes it works.
A minor complaint on "LLMs are simply not capable of producing new knowledge". In mathematics, new knowledge is certainly available through the use of LLMs, and technicalities or stating that it was implicit in the sources won't convince my colleagues. What I do is try to show that the actual cost is overwhelmingly bigger than the benefit.
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@aesthr Great article! Thank you!