Post by @pho4cexa@tiny.tilde.website

i am of the age that i was traumatized by java and the hype around oop and now i flinch away from anything describing itself as object-oriented

i wonder if pharo is good. i wonder if there is anything redeemable about object oriented programming

i will probably never know, except through reports by trusted comrades brave enough to perform a technology survey with the benefit of hindsight. i can't

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Jason Lefkowitz

@jalefkowit@hachyderm.io 2 hr. ago

@pho4cexa I suspect we are of similar age. I eventually found I liked OOP, but I could not get there until I was able to strip all of the religion out of it

Brit

@kingcons@tiny.tilde.website 4 hr. ago

@pho4cexa I question whether I'll ever get around to it. I've been wanting to play with GToolkit for years though.

Effectively none of the appeal for me is about OOP though. The majority of the appeal is seeing other points outside of the "Programming Hornet's Nest" described by Tomas P here: https://tomasp.net/techdims/#footer=index,navigation;left=catalogue,list;top=catalogue,index

What does it look like for a programming system to _not_ just be a compiler, editor plugin, and a debugger or language server? To me, that's an interesting question.

Technical dimensions of programming systems

Framework that captures the characteristics of programming systems, makes it possible to compare and better understand them and find interesting new points in their design space.

Aaron Brady

@insom@tiny.tilde.website 56 min. ago

@kingcons @pho4cexa first of all: this website's aesthetics are absolutely great.

It's also made me aware that I totally slept on Jupyter Notebooks because I've always dismissed them as for "Data People" (despite briefly being one, myself). What could they be like if I wasn't querying data lakes with them?

Also I know someone who works on GToolkit! It sounds like those folks haven't changed their message one bit, except AI is maybe making "you don't understand your software" an easier sell.

Aaron Brady

@insom@tiny.tilde.website 50 min. ago

@kingcons @pho4cexa It's also fun to look back at 90's adverts and propaganda about Objects.

IMO what businesses really wanted from OOP was not object orientation, it was libraries and convenient ways to call them (and abstractions, so it would be more possible to make developers fungible). Plus ça change.

(So, really, components).

I did a fair bit of Squeak and lots of Java. Apart from the refactoring browser etc. I'd say most of the _feeling_ of Smalltalk can be gotten by just writing Ruby.

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